Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

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Missile5
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Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Missile5 » September 10th, 2017, 1:31 am

Recently got hold of a Final fight arcade pcb and noticed the A-Board has a printed sticker saying "CPS DASH" on it.

What does this mean? I thought CPS Dash was used for later games. Thank you.

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Hokuto » September 10th, 2017, 3:05 am

They're just newer A board models. Supposedly they were made to run the newer games such as SF2 Turbo, as running it on the larger, older motherboards will result in incorrect speed (and viceversa, when trying to play an older game on a CPS Dash board).

Although I don't have access to a SF2T board, I have a SF2CE on a CPS Dash mobo and it runs perfectly fine. Same deal with Captain Commando, I replaced the original motherboard it came with (older large style) with a Dash one and it runs the same.

So who knows :roll:
No

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by leonardoliveira » September 10th, 2017, 3:47 pm

CPS DASH is the official name for what people call "CPS 1.5".

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P.S.: I don't know what they call the regular boards with 12Mhz 68000. Older boards have 10Mhz 68000 in them. Of course, the boards with the Qsound system always have 12Mhz 68000 in them.

Edit: I found non Q-Sound plastic-boxed games with "CP System (DASH)" marked on them as well. So seems like the "DASH" thing indeed is about the beefier CPU.

I stand corrected, good sir. :shifty:
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by sergiopolog » September 10th, 2017, 6:07 pm

CPS Dash is the enhanced version of CPS1 Mainboard (A board), it has a faster 68000 processor (12MHz) instead of original processor of the early CPS1 A Boards. It also has the audio section revamped and it's shorter in length than original one.

Capcom developed it around 1992 and its used for example in SF2 Champion Edition and SF2 Turbo HyperFighting. Those games run faster because of the faster processor. If you used an "old" 10MHz board with B+C boards in those games, they run significantly slower (but not viceversa).

This mainboard is also used in "CPS1.5" Games, but removed its audio compoments (they are replaced by the ones in QSound board), and is for that why CPS1.5 systems are also ("wrongly") called CPS Dash. ;)

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by fluxcore » September 10th, 2017, 7:33 pm

There are also short a-boards which are NOT 12MHz, they also don't have the 'CPS DASH' sticker on them (although this may have fallen off anyway).

Only way to be sure is to check the rating of the 68000 (-10 or -12) and the crystals, I guess.

To the OP: switch out the final fight a-board for a 10MHz one, then if you end up with a SF2CE or HF board with a 10MHz board, correct that problem too :)

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Missile5 » September 11th, 2017, 1:00 am

Thanks for the info on CPS Dash. Yes mine is a short A-Board with CPS Dash sticker. Good to know if I ever get a CPS Dash game I will have a spare A board for it :)

I'm confused about whether Final Fight will run correct speed on this A Board. From what sergiopolog and Hokuto say in their posts I'm presuming it does run at the right speed?

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by rugdoctor » September 11th, 2017, 1:47 am

Correct me if I am wrong, but I am pulling the emergency break on this cps dash having faster gameplay acknowledgement.

Though it is true there is a difference in the clock speed(?) of the dash and regular motherboard, Hyper Fighting/Turbo edition runs at the same speed on both the dash and non-dash motherboards. There is no game that I know of that utilised the increase speed :(

Again, please let me know if I made a mistake with my findings...
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by leonardoliveira » September 11th, 2017, 2:45 am

What defines the gameplay speed is the video interrupt. Having higher CPU clock means it can execute more instructions between each video frame. Basically means it will slow down less than the older board on a screen full of stuff that need to move. Anything left of CPU time the game doesn't need will be wasted on a idle loop (aka unused).

I got a Tenchi Wo Kurau2 board (japanese version of the one I put a picture for) and I used it to test a faulty CPS1 I had here (the normal one 10Mhz.) and it worked alright (I had to swap one of the PAL chips for it to work) it worked but the game ran a bit jerky on the controls. But absolutely playable.

If a game really need the dash board it will work on the normal board but you will notice it will play "sluggish".
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by rugdoctor » September 11th, 2017, 3:24 am

I know my hyper fighting board and final Fight certainly did not need it.
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Missile5 » September 17th, 2017, 7:34 pm

leonardoliveira wrote:What defines the gameplay speed is the video interrupt. Having higher CPU clock means it can execute more instructions between each video frame. Basically means it will slow down less than the older board on a screen full of stuff that need to move. Anything left of CPU time the game doesn't need will be wasted on a idle loop (aka unused).
In that case will older boards that have slowdown have it lessened by running on CPS dash A board?

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by leonardoliveira » September 17th, 2017, 8:12 pm

Missile5 wrote:In that case will older boards that have slowdown have it lessened by running on CPS dash A board?
Yes, pretty much, if the slowdown cause is lack of CPU time. But then some games on other platforms use this kind of slowdown as gameplay mechanic (Cave Stuff as example) :lol:
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Missile5 » September 18th, 2017, 1:24 am

leonardoliveira wrote:
Missile5 wrote:In that case will older boards that have slowdown have it lessened by running on CPS dash A board?
Yes, pretty much, if the slowdown cause is lack of CPU time. But then some games on other platforms use this kind of slowdown as gameplay mechanic (Cave Stuff as example) :lol:
Thanks, I haven't noticed much slowdown on the few CPS1 boards i have but if I find any I will switch to my Dash A board. I would imagine that some of the CPS1 schmups might have some?

Metal Slug 2 uses slowdown as a gameplay feature too.... I think.... :)

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Flinnster » September 18th, 2017, 2:06 am

Nice info above. My recently picked up Daimakamura conversion is a CPS DASH A-board. God knows what game it was from originally of course.
I'll have to look through my other CPS boards and see if I have any more stickers of this type - can't say I'd ever noticed before!
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Missile5 » September 19th, 2017, 6:42 pm

Flinnster wrote:Nice info above. My recently picked up Daimakamura conversion is a CPS DASH A-board. God knows what game it was from originally of course.
I'll have to look through my other CPS boards and see if I have any more stickers of this type - can't say I'd ever noticed before!
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Very nice looking Daimakamura Board there mate.

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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Flinnster » September 20th, 2017, 12:13 am

Thanks :)

I've actually cleaned it up since that photo was taken, as the A board was pretty grubby with that kind of sticky dust residue that just won't shift without alcohol. The B & C boards were nicely labelled though by the previous owner which makes it all look very neat.
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Re: Final Fight A-Board "CPS DASH"

Post by Drumaster » September 24th, 2017, 11:19 pm

Hi,

I swapped the A-board of my Final Fight with a Dash one and it has now less slowdowns in the heavy scenes (subway in stage 2 or stage 5/6 for instance), that's pretty cool (even if there were not that many ones before). That's crazy to see what the CPS1 can handle in term of sprite number and size. :)

AFAIK and as far as I have tested myself, only Hyper Fighting runs faster at 12Mhz, not CE and WW (I own those games). Game code had to be written a specific way so the game could take advantage of the speed increase to run faster with 12Mhz, otherwise it would simply have less potential slowdowns.

And yes the 1st game to have a Dash board was SFII CE.

The reason why Capcom upgraded the Motorola 10Mhz to a 12Mhz one may be simply because the 10Mhz was not produced anymore and the 12Mhz had become the current generation at that time, not because their games needed this.

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